Forum:Her Undying Majesty

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OK, it's always seemed clear to me that Her Undying Majesty, Albia, Queen of England (and Scotland and Ireland?) is a clank. Strictly speculative, but I envision her as being having not an anthropoid body but an enormous sedentary machine housing. In essence, I see her as being halfway between Anevka Sturmvoraus and Castle Heterodyne.

My evidence for this?

(1) We know that "Her Undying Majesty" has perpetuated her life extraordinarily. This is evinced by the fact that Countess Marie is a third cousin many times removed, of course ✣ . Cousins are "removed" by the difference between their generations, so if she is (say) a third cousin, four times removed, that means that Marie's great-great-grandmother was third cousins with Albia (i.e. their great-grandparents were siblings). The "of course" emphasises that is is absurd to think Marie is of the same generation as Albia. NOTE: This quote is the only evidence that I can see for thinking that Albia has any human components and isn't just an enormous clank like Mr. Tock, as this is the only evidence I can find that Albia is actually alive.

(2) Albia is obviously powerful but, more than that, she seems to be PERSONALLY powerful. Reference is always made to her survival being crucial to keeping Wulfenbach out of England. This strikes me as more consistent with her being an enormous clank, capable of co-ordinating information and other subordinate clanks than her just being a powerful spark. Moreover, England is almost unquestioningly under her authority. The idea that there would be a host of people trying to usurp her (as there are in the case of Klaus) seems nothing short of unthinkable.

(3) My favourite piece of evidence: Gilgamesh, when threatening Wooster ✣ , does not say that he will kill Albia if Wooster betrays him, but that he will destroy her (and refers to her in "scare quotes" no less). Now you might think that this just means that he's going to destroy her empire, but he THEN goes on to explain what will happen to England.

That's what I think, anyway. --Cantabrian 11:20, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Brilliant. It occurs to me to wonder if the Enigma is actually Albia; probably not, and not particularly related to your suggestion. Anyway, simply brilliant. ⚙Zarchne 21:37, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

I further speculate that Albia's body was constructed by van Rijn. This would make the great spark's work especially relevant to Tarvek's. ⚙Zarchne 21:17, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

I'm puzzled.  Why is everyone overlooking this bit: "Only Albia of England is my senior - and her methods of eternal loveliness are a secret even to me"? ✣ ?  If Albia is a clank, it's clearly not known to anyone - even the Master of Paris, who is a bit of an expert on this kind of thing himself.  It's just possible that she is (or, at least, is represented by) a really, really lifelike clank, such that nobody can tell the difference (especially if she doesn't allow those not in the know to get too close to her royal personage).  But it would be a stretch, especially as said clank must have been built over 200 years ago, before even Van Rijn's day.  Wizardblizzard1 (talk) 01:25, December 2, 2017 (UTC)

Now here´s a *really* mad idea: what if Her Undying Majesty is something like Castle Heterodyne, perhaps even on a bigger scale... dare I suggest, on the scale that Britain as whole is now a sentient structure? Gil said "melt what is left of your miserable island to slag", suggesting that the act of destroying Her Undying Majesty (scare quotes or not) would do substantial damage to the island of Britain. In that case, the Queen Albia to which Countess Marie is related would be the person who imprinted her personality on Her Undying Majesty - the counterpart to Faustus Heterodyne for Castle Heterodyne. -Sir Chaos 19:09, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

No. "What is left of your miserable island" does not refer to any damage the island might sustain as a result of Gil destroying Albia. A map of Europa Wulfenbach, which appeared in issue 9 of the original Girl Genius comic, and which is currently available in a larger form from Cafe Press, shows that at some time in the past, the British Isles were heavily damaged, leaving only a few small scattered remnants still above water.

There are other references to this as well, such as the presence of many submarines, in addition to many airships, in the card game "The Works" which is based on Girl Genius. Many of the people of the British Isles now live underwater, in some sort of airtight structures. --Quadibloc 00:57, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Sir Chaos' above suggestion is an extension of Cantabrian's original point (2), and I like it, although I don't imagine something quite as self-modifiable as Castle Heterodyne. Quadibloc is quite correct with the facts, of course, although I don't see that they necessarily rule out that destroying Albia would cause further geographic damage to the already miserable remains.

The most interesting consequence of this theory so far, in my awareness, is that, if true, Albia would be a model of stability and legitimacy that Tarvek (who in fact had control of Anevka-clank) had planned to appeal to, to defend Anevka's claim to the throne at least of Sturmhalten. That is, until he's ready to claim the empire as the Storm King, she is in a stronger position to rule.

⚙Zarchne 00:04, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

And what about Gil's "To go against Albia of England's merest whim is literally unthinkable." Mind control? Perhaps Albia is even more pervasive than a mechanical island. Ordinary 05:05, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

In the GGLOPE (hope I have that acronym right), it lists Princess Urania as being "Currently the most popular of Her Undying Majesty's perpetually-frustrated and often fast-living heirs." In the Trelawney Thorpe short story, Urania certainly seemed human. More importantly, the implication in the quoted section is that Albia DOES have heirs who are "fast-living" -- which implies she's not a machine. At least, not entirely.Sugeatarc 04:37, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

In part, that means that the princes and princesses get to indulge in dangerous exercises which heirs are usually kept from - the Queen's not going to die, therefore the heirs are so far superfluous. They have to vent their frustration somehow, after all. (leaves wondering about Sugeatarc's jackalope for later) -- Corgi 06:33, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

I'm talking about the Girl Genius List of Practically Everyone, or whatever it's actually called. (Note: just looked it up and it's the GGCLAE.) And I know what fast-living means -- my point was that Albia apparently has human heirs, and quite a few of them. Ergo, not a machine, or not completely.Sugeatarc 18:12, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

This doesn´t rule out the Castle Heterodyne - i.e. that a human Queen Albia (Princess Urania´s ancestor) either transferred or copied her personality into a machine, like Faustus Heterodyne (Agatha´s ancestor) did with the Castle. -Sir Chaos 19:07, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Sorry - was teasing about the jackalope, and the way you said that, I thought there was a chance you (or someone else) might be taking the phrase literally. -- Corgi 21:19, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Maybe Alba is a brain in a jar. With a crown on top of the jar. :) I've wondered if what Alba (usually a term for England itself) is something that is trying to raise England back above the surface of the North Sea. -Grumpy Celt69.19.14.30 00:30, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Albia, near. Albia, with in "I" inside. And I think "Alba" is Scotland. England is "Albion". But I like the idea with a brain jar with a crown on it. -Sir Chaos 11:10, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Gotta love Wikipedia:

Alba is the Scottish Gaelic name (IPA: [ˈalˠ̪əpə]) for Scotland. It is cognate to Albain in Irish Gaelic and Nalbin in Manx, the other Goidelic Insular Celtic language, as well as similar words in the Brythonic Insular Celtic languages of Cornish (Alban) and Welsh (Yr Alban) also meaning Scotland.

Hence also the early classical name Albion. It was used by the Gaels to refer to the island as a whole until roughly the ninth or tenth centuries, when it came to be the name given to the kingdoms of the Picts and the Scots (Pictavia and Dál Riata), north of the Firth of Forth and the Firth of Clyde, traditionally considered to have been unified by Kenneth MacAlpin. The region Breadalbane (Bràghad Albainn, the upper part of "Alba") takes its name from it as well.

The Latin word alba is the feminine singular form of albus, meaning white in English.

As time passed that kingdom incorporated others to the southern territories. It became Latinized in the High Medieval period as "Albania" (it is unclear whether it may ultimately share the same etymon as the modern Albania). This latter word was employed mainly by Celto-Latin writers, and most famously by Geoffrey of Monmouth. It was this word which passed into Middle English as Albany, although very rarely was this used for the Kingdom of Scotland, but rather for the notional Duchy of Albany. From the latter the capital of the U.S. state of New York, Albany, takes its name.

And as I added to the article itself:

Gallo-Latin Albiōn (cf. Middle Irish Albbu) derives from the Proto-Celtic * Alb-i̯en-, sharing the same stem as Welsh elfydd "earth, world". Together with other toponyms such as Alpes it derives from a Proto-Indo-European root *albh- "white".[1]

It is often hypothesised that the Romans took it as connected with albus (white), in reference to the white cliffs of Dover and Alfred Holder's Alt-Keltischer Sprachschatz (1896) unhesitatingly translates it Weissland ("white-land").

However, Her Majesty's name is clearly 'Albia', no matter her former or current state. Considering she has fairly normal potential heirs, if she's a brain in a jar, she's got something else hooked up too producing Urania and her implied siblings. -- Corgi 21:15, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

Calling it Alba was simply my misspelling. And she could have had children before before she was reduced to brain-in-a-jar status. -Grumpy Celt66.82.9.74 00:32, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Here's a theory: Assume Albia is a clank. Assume this clank is very old. Assume there are legitimate human heirs. Albia/Albion is a large Castle-Heterodynish clank, may be one castle, may be all of Brittania, irrelevant for this point. An early sparky monarch, let's equate him with William the Conqueror, builds a castle and does Faustus before Faustus did, implanting his personality into an undying machine, his human body dying in the process. While William II grows into adulthood, he protracts a fatal injury or illness. To save his son, William I has him also downloaded into the castle, forming a gestalt personality acting as king. Through the generations, this becomes standard practice. When the heir is about to die, to age, infirmity or injury they download themselves into the eternal castle. This creates a royal culture in which the current heir is encouraged to have as many children as possible, to ensure continuation after their death and creating rumors of fast-living, while also creating a strong internal stability because as more personalities are added, individual "voices" become less distinct, and new ideas within the system become less likely to be noticed or considered. Through absorbing the royal family, it has become England itself, hence the name. It being Albia instead of Albion and identifying itself as feminine, is because it associates itself most strongly with the latest heir added to it out of respect for them, in this case the most recent was Princess Alexandria Victoria Hanover.--Necrotas 08:28, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

HOO YEZ! Der perfect zyztem uv monarky! 08:47, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

Now that I've had some sleep, I can elaborate on the "mind control" issue in regards to my Monarch theory. The two confirmed Englishmen that have appeared in the comic itself are Ardsley Wooster and Captain Radio-Hat, and frankly, neither of them seemed particularly mind controlled to me. Also, the only confirmed mind control to appear in the comic is the Other's Slaver Wasps, which have always been portrayed as undeniably, obviously evil, while England, barring one comment by Gil, has always been referred as neutral or even positive, ie. Gil wanted Agatha hidden there while he dealt with Europa, and the circus went there for asylum until everything died down. This makes me think that it may be less mind control then social control. Much like Mechanicsburghers have become the ideal Heterodyne minions through centuries of what amounts to selective breeding, but from a different direction. This presupposes real-world stereotypes, specifically the English being traditionally associated with loyalty and pride toward "Queen and Country" and simply being English. You have that tendency, combined with centuries where the Monarch has been accepted as being more or less the literal personification of Eternal England, and a culture, and thus a people, develop where disobeying the Queen, and by extension betraying England, isn't even treason anymore, it's a concept which simply doesn't exist within English psychology.-- 15:29, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

                 -Re: Wooster und de Captain appearing uncontrolled, so did most of de revenants. but hyu have a point about de way England is treated -- Gil did not suggest dot Agatha should go to Paris, which we know now is also neutral. Perhaps he knew about de Master of Paris' opinion of Heterodynes? Und even if England is know for controlling her own people, perhaps Sparks are more difficult? Or perhaps it is something dot happens when de English are small, and Agatha is too old to be taken by it? 18:56, November 23, 2017 (UTC)

Ah yes.  "For we are the people of England who never have spoken yet."   Actually, the people of England tend to speak a great deal and occasionally follow up with half-bricks, but the reputation seems to be indelible.  Makes me wonder exactly how far north the situation, whatever the situation is, extends. (Given that the north of England has always displayed such unflinching loyalty to the Crown that in the 18th century we repeatedly tried to invite the French over to see if they'd do a better job.) 

I suppose we'll find out what the situation is pretty soon, if there's anything to find.  One tiny thing that suddenly struck me is that the plot's ended up with Agatha and Tarvek being the ones going to England - they being the only two of our heroes who can "heterodyne".  Maybe this has some relevance to something and maybe not.  Wizardblizzard1 (talk) 01:05, December 29, 2017 (UTC)

Lucrezia/Agatha's control voice is a more morally gray version of mind control. Perhaps the monarch of England is of Mongfish descent, and uses some precursor of Lucrezia's body switching technology to qualify for both immortality and being unable to even think of disobeying her.

Hrm. In retrospect, if it goes back this far, it doesn't really account for the Tudors being only slightly related to the Plantagenets and their ilk. Then the Stuarts, who weren't related to the Tudors really at all. Then William of Orange inavding England and replacing James II. Then House Hanover, who, again, not related in any meaningful way, but were the closest Protestants, and by God, England wasn't gonna' be ruled by filthy papists again, no sirree. This could easily be explained by simply having the first one be George I, instead of William the Conqueror, by I don't think 178 years of unbroken rule is really as neat as 816.--Necrotas 04:41, February 23, 2010 (UTC)

Actually, this only matters if I'm married to the Queen Victoria idea. It could just be one unbroken line of Normans from William to [CURRENTNORMANROYAL]. Or maybe I'm overthinking this...--Necrotas 07:05, February 23, 2010 (UTC)

Has anybody seen the sketch of Albia that Phil Foglio did for somebody on giantitp forums? She doesn't look her age, hehe. Grue3 14:28, February 23, 2010 (UTC)

She looks to be a cross between The Wizard of Oz and a Playboy foldout model. Billy Catringer 07:52, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps disloyalty is unthinkable because of telepathic monitoring of peoples' thoughts, plus a strong Secret Police presence?

And the Brain In A Jar™ Theory does not necessarily rule out heirs, if you allow for clones. Remember, we have only seen one heir. What if the others are all female, all identical?

BTW--in Greek Mythology, Urania means Heavenly, & is the name of the Muse of Astronomy. "Muse"? Hmmmmm.....--Bosda Di'Chi 15:24, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

Good point.  "Unthinkable", in the context, could mean either impossible or merely illegal!  Incidentally, either way Albia (or whoever she got to set this up for her, it it wasn't her own work) would have to be a bit of a specialist in brain-meddling, so I'm curious to know what she did in the war.  (Or, if nothing, why not.)  Maybe we'll find out. Wizardblizzard1 (talk) 01:05, December 29, 2017 (UTC)

You don't even need to "allow for clones" for the Brain In A Jar™ Theory. If your son (or daughter) dies while you're still alive, your grandchild (assuming only one) becomes your heir. When you outlive him or her, your great-grandchild(ren). And so on.... --DHBirr,

Albia could by not unlike the godlike cyborg Emperor of Man from Warhammer 40,000. If she'd plugged herself into a Castle-like super-clank, she could well be "undying", because of the life-support mechanisms that contain her body. As for breeding, consider the machines the Wraith Hive Queens from Stargate Atlantis use. 212.219.245.253 12:36, February 10, 2012 (UTC)

SHE--aka Ayesha a.k.a "SHE WHO MUST BE OBEYED"--is a character from the Rider Haggard Novel "SHE". She has the power to irresistibly control men's' minds when they look upon her beauty, and is Immortal. Immortality is conferred by a mystic fire. The parallels are too strong to overlook. Bosda Di'Chi (talk)

Hy iz not sure vy pipple tink it iz so odd for somevun to live hundreds ov years around here!  Wizardblizzard1 (talk) 01:08, December 29, 2017 (UTC)

I believe Albia is in fact perfectly human, but also more than human. The way she's able to changer her volume at will, and the constant changes in appearance, however, is why she's MORE than just Albia: She's also all the missing female sparks! She's touched the infinite-no, that's not right-she's constantly IN the infinite! The problem with that mind-state is that it's too much information for any one-individual. But if she's got the combine circuits of every vanished female spark from the last thousand years? She's got buffers for ages! Plenty of pathways to shunt the extra. It's why she's constantly referring to herself as "us" and "we". Because Albia isn't a person: She's a people! BreakingBlue (talk) 22 May 2018

STARS!

Urania means Heavenly, & is the name of the Muse of Astronomy. Urania, in Art, is depicted with a Crown of Stars fl;oating around her head--lust like Albia has! Bosda Di'Chi (talk) 11:55, March 1, 2018 (UTC)